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Post by gabbie on Aug 13, 2006 6:39:40 GMT
I'm aware they don't see eye-to-eye on everything (i.e, she's more romantic and he's too work oriented), but no couples do. Couples don't always get along, they don't always agree, they're not always perfect. Ever. I think their relationship is perfectly healthy; they have their flaws, sure, but they like each other in spite of them.
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Post by dannyphantomcute on Aug 13, 2006 6:43:53 GMT
I'm aware they don't see eye-to-eye on everything (i.e, she's more romantic and he's too work oriented), but no couples do. Couples don't always get along, they don't always agree, they're not always perfect. Ever. I think their relationship is perfectly healthy; they have their flaws, sure, but they like each other in spite of them. You make good arguments, but that doesn't mean I like how she treats Nigle some times. I dispise the way she calls him names  like in Operation Leader she was so mean to him. |
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Post by gabbie on Aug 13, 2006 6:51:31 GMT
I haven't seen LEADER in a while, so I don't really remember their interactions. However, I do know that in every other episode I've seen and have with them, she isn't mean at all. She makes mistakes, sure (the boyfriend helmet in LIZZIE, the delightful-impersonation in CAKED-TWO) but she always apologizes or makes up for it (her driving the ship into the cake was amazing).
Maybe she was mean in LEADER (I don't know), but she's shown no signs on meanness towards him in any other episodes (strong mindedness or bossyness, maybe, but not meanness). The only instances I can think of is when she shoved him into the pool in POOL, after he was flirting with Eizzil, and in HOLIDAY when she was pissed because she thought he was cheating--the first time he totally deserved it, and the second time was a totally normal reaction on Lizzie's part(any girl I know would be pissed if they thought they're boyfriend was cheating). So, yeah.
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Post by unifilar on Aug 13, 2006 6:53:02 GMT
No, she doesn't have to hover over the boy every waking second, but it'd be nice for her to be there when his character is being dramatically developed. Otherwise it seems like while the rest of him is maturing/changing, Lizzie is being left behind. I sure as heck got that impression in ZERO.
Just to say- part of being a good operative is knowing when being reckless is best and putting your better judgement over orders (see DIAPER, when Numbuh 5 went against orders). Numbuh 1's recklessness and such lead to victiory in the end. I think every Sector V member has gone against an order or two at some point- and I certainly wouldn't count them all out for the TND.
EDIT:
In LEADER, she basically proved that she couldn't be trusted. She flirted with another operative to get her way, and then in the end, she 'promised' that she would never attempt to play leader again, and then went and did it again without hesitation.
Of all things, I never thought of Nigel/Lizzie as 'healthy'. Certainly, the theory that their relationship follows masochism isn't particularly healthy.
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Post by gabbie on Aug 13, 2006 6:57:40 GMT
She can't exactly help it if she's not there when the important things happen. She's not psychic--and, well, a non-KND member would probably get in the way in those instances anyway. And I was greatly, greatly saddened by the lack of Lizzie in ZERO, thank you for remiding me. And I'm not saying that he's not good enough for the TND--I do know that it all ended up well in ZERO and every other time; just as he is now, it doesn't seem that likely--to me, anyway. Three years is a long time, I can't make any judgement's on what he'll be like then. Also, she's ten. She's not exactly the most mature person in the world, and I know I manipulated plenty of people to my whims when I was her age. And I wouldn't really call her "untrustworthy"--after all, Hoagie stole a turkey in CLUES at an important dinner party, and that seems a tad more serious than "playing leader" to me, and yet no one calls Hoagie untrustworthy for that! (Me included) And I don't see what's so masochistic about them--after all, your ship is the one with "bondage"  Anyway, this has been fun, but I have a fic to write, so I'd better be off. |
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Post by dannyphantomcute on Aug 13, 2006 7:02:58 GMT
Oh yah that thing in Leader got me so ticked, I just feel she shouldn't have done that at all. And I didn't really think of it as a good relationship either but people have different opinions I guess  |
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Post by unifilar on Aug 13, 2006 7:21:55 GMT
Did you flirt with another boy when you had a boyfriend? I just don't think there's lot of trust in that relationship. She had PROMISED never to be the leader of Sector V again, and she went back on her word in a heartbeat. I just could never trust someone like that.
I think Lizzie lying to be the leader of Sector V is more serious, because a failed mission could've lead to dire consequences, perfectly shown in GROW-UP. An eaten turkey hardly seems to compare.
Actually, there's big differences between bondage and masochism, as directly compared in the online urban dictionary, but that's another debate for another day. ;D
And I believe the creator of this thread displayed their theory about the masochistic behaviors of Nigel/Lizzie quite well. -nods-
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Post by digigirl02 on Aug 13, 2006 15:35:49 GMT
What about Lunch? Lizzie did save the day. (Sort of) , and Nigel doesn't seem the type to date a team mate, since he always seems to go on solo missions.
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Post by unifilar on Aug 13, 2006 17:56:15 GMT
What about Lunch? Lizzie did save the day. (Sort of) , and Nigel doesn't seem the type to date a team mate, since he always seems to go on solo missions. Granted, Lizzie did 'save the day' in LUNCH, but somehow I get the feeling it was for her own needs, not anyone else's. If you put it that way, Hoagie doesn't seem like the type to date a teammate either, because he usually goes off and does his own thing too. It's not like Nigel never depended on another teammate to get the job done anyway. |
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Post by osumashi on Aug 13, 2006 19:48:35 GMT
Oh, you mean like Numbuh 5 (she has somewhat of a habit of challenging his authority, as seen in DIAPER and other episodes)? Oh....you mean like Numbuh 5 (in JEWELS she pulled no punches when Nigel didn't appreciate her gift, and she has told him on a few occasions that he's 'crazy')? Granted, Numbuh 5 tends to display the latter quality less than Lizzie does, and it's really not a factor in her and Numbuh 1's relationship. Yeah, those things occured to me as I started the post. I guess if Nigel and Lizzie ever break up, Abigail would be the next best person for Nigel, unless he's adamantly against dating team members. |
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Post by sunnybunny on Aug 13, 2006 20:41:20 GMT
Well, they make a good couple! And I´m sure that when Lizzie grows older, she also goes prettier!
Before op. ZERO I was shipping 1/5, but right now I´m in the middle of 1/Lizzie and 1/362...
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Post by scone on Aug 13, 2006 20:58:54 GMT
Granted, Lizzie did 'save the day' in LUNCH, but somehow I get the feeling it was for her own needs, not anyone else's. It was to get back the lunch she'd made for Nigel. I guess if Nigel and Lizzie ever break up, Abigail would be the next best person for Nigel, unless he's adamantly against dating team members. Which I could see him being. It's a conflict of interest to date somebody you're in command of. Did you flirt with another boy when you had a boyfriend? I just don't think there's lot of trust in that relationship. This coming from the ship that states Nigel's in love with somebody while dating somebody else. That's equally skeevy. Dunno, people can disagree with 1/Lizzie all they want (even though it makes me SAD SAD SAD) but... it's canon. So it wins. PS anyone who's a fan of 1/Lizzie I just made a pairing thread so we can discuss stuff without people coming in and bashing on our ship here |
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Post by unifilar on Aug 13, 2006 21:24:49 GMT
Right. She did it so SHE could get back to HER boyfriend. Lizzie will do anything to get what she wants, and it just so happened to lead her to 'save the day'.
Tell that to the several other canon ships that have relationships within a team (a direct leader/teammate canon ship is Robin/Starfire from Teen Titans). And 'liking' someone within your same team could prove a problem in the first place, and yet there's 3/4.
Depending on how you play it. If Nigel goes out with Lizzie while two-timing her with Abby on the side- THAT'S skeevy (which is a pretty fun word to pronounce, by the way). But if Nigel realizes he likes Abby and breaks up with Lizzie, I see nothing skeevy about that.
Takeshi/Fantine was canon in IGPX, but they broke up, so in the end it didn't 'win'. I dislike having the canon card being played just to trump everything else- just because it's canon doesn't make it the right ship for you (I'm using 'you' generally here), or even the show.
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Post by digigirl02 on Aug 14, 2006 3:16:49 GMT
Quote:Which I could see him being. It's a conflict of interest to date somebody you're in command of.
Tell that to the several other canon ships that have relationships within a team (a direct leader/teammate canon ship is Robin/Starfire from Teen Titans). And 'liking' someone within your same team could prove a problem in the first place, and yet there's 3/4.
But that doesn't seem like the case with Nigel.
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Post by applepeachshimmer on Aug 14, 2006 6:21:01 GMT
aw. i agree<3
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like in Operation Leader she was so mean to him. 
